GROW BY LEARNING

Sunday, June 22, 2008

PREACHING AND TEACHING

PREACHING/TEACHING/PASTOR: FIRST BAPTIST CHURCH, ALTOONA, KANSAS 1980 - 1996

CHARITY WHISNANT, AND ERIC AND BECKY AND CHAD IN 1980

I have already written several posts about our ministry in Altoona, Kansas. I was thirty two and Charity was 31 when we came. Eric was nine and Becky was four. Chad was born in July of our first year, and Kyle was born in December 1984. I still remember that first Sunday we came to preach. I can remember meeting with the men about the possibility of us coming to pastor the church. I did my best to get out of coming, but they answered all my question with a "yes." And Charity was praying that I would say no, and the church would say no. The church wished they had said no after the first month! But as the Lord would have it, He said "yes" and we came and stayed for sixteen years.

Charity and I loved the ministry and the people. Eric and Becky and Chad and Kyle loved the ministry and the kids. Today we still love the folks who were in the church when we were there. It's really great that we can still have long distance fellowship with them today.

Footnote: I love this new scanner that the kids bought me for Father's Day, making the photos possible. Thank you for this great gift! I love you all and appreciate your thoughtfulness and generosity.)
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Photo: Charles, preaching in 1982 I think. But we had remodeled the building. That in itself is a good story to tell. We also moved from the house into our remodeled house in Dec 1984. That also is a great story. Right Kurt Nunnenkamp?
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From Topical Preaching to Expository Teaching

I also have addressed this issue as well. We began in 1983 to teach the book of Matthew on Sunday Morning and Romans on Sunday Evening. And four hundred sermons later we finished both books. HOW LONG SHOULD ONE PREACH OR TEACH? I am addressing this issue presently. If I had taught 29 minutes, the church might have been full and overflowing. But fifty five minutes of teaching from one verse or two, took a lot of discipline on the part of the folks. I still have those sermon manuscripts on Matthew and Romans. And we also have those old tapes. Goodness. I am going to scan those too. Boy, you might be questioning the gift the kids gave me before long.

Saturday, June 21, 2008

HOW MANY BOOKS ARE TOO MANY

In a previous post I asked: How Many Books are Too Many?

The second photo was taken in 1969 after Charity and I were married. We lived in Fort Worth Texas. Our living space was in our two little rooms, inside a house where we lived. But I needed space for a book case for all my books. We had more books than clothes. When we moved from Fort Worth to Wooster, Ohio, in March of 1970, we had our clothes, kitchen necessities and thirty-two boxes of books!

The first and second photos were taken in 1990's when I was Pastor/Teacher of First Baptist Church in Altoona, Kansas. Kurt Nunnenkamp built these extra nice book shelves, built to fit the room in my church office. These books were my technical books used to study. Plus, I had a room where I had my other books, used as the Church Library.

Reading books has been a part of my schedule since I was a young person. I loved reading in middle school, I read history books, and books about people mostly.

In Seminary, Dr. Luther Peak took us to his Church Library and gave us information how to catalog books and papers in our library. I had cataloged my books by numbering them one to 150. Dr. Peak said start with the books you have now.

Over the years, the number of books for my studies increased.

When I moved to Altoona, Kansas, I started my own system of filing my books. I was able to catalog each book on a library card with a specific number. It was my own "Dewey Decimal System". That was great since I had several thousand books I also filed papers and articles so as to find them when needed.

FILING ALL MATERIAL IN A SYSTEM WAS NECESSARY:

All my sermons had a numbering system, (I used the John MacArthur's system in cataloging sermons) all my religious papers had a numbering system, and all my books had a numbering systems, all my church papers and folders had a numbering system. I catalog all three ring binders.

I read that Charles Spurgeon read books, and his desk was filled with books while he studied. I picked up on Spurgeon's practice.

You couldn't have too many books in those days.

TODAY IS A LITTLE DIFFERENT I AM AFRAID

When I moved to Lexington, Kentucky, I had little room to put my books. (I left most of my books and many of the papers in Altoona, Kansas). Finally moving to Portsmouth, I had less room and most of the books are stacked in boxes. But I do manage to keep some books in book cases. When you don't have a nice church office to keep all your study material, you are in disarray.

This has gone down the history road. My Dad had a Christian book store, and he had a few books himself. I wished I had been old enough to have kept those books.

So how many books are too many? Good question.

Charles and Donald Whisnant

CHARLES AND DONALD WHISNANT
IN 1951 WOULD YOU BELIEVE

IS A 29 MINUTE SERMON SCRIPTURAL

IS A 29 MINUTE SERMON SCRIPTURAL PART 2

When I was pastor/teacher of First Baptist Church in Altoona, Kansas I usually would start the message with something like this:

We have been for many months studying Paul's marvelous epistle to Ephesians, or I could say Philippians, or Romans, and I Corinthians. And we return to that epistle and chapter ? for our study this morning.

We systematically go through the Word of God emphasizing these New Testament books because

every word is pure,

every word proceeds from the very heart of God,

every word of Scripture is indeed to us a treasure

as well as a responsibility for our edification and our obedience.

And Eric, my son said, "but Dad you teaching even the . and , and : and ;. Funny Eric.

My comment was, if every word is pure, and comes from the very heart of God, why shouldn't we teach on every word in the New Testament? So I really tried to do that.

Part two today: WHY SPEAK 45 MINUTES WHEN YOU COULD SPEAK 30 MINTUES? AND I WOULD ARGUE "WHY SPEAK 30 MINUTES WHEN YOU SHOULD SPEAK 55 MINUTES, IF YOU ARE GOING TO SPEAK EXPOSITORIAL?

Ephesians 1:1

"Paul" (several sermons) "

"an apostle of Jesus Christ" (several messages)

"to the saints which are at Ephesius"

"and to the faithful in Christ Jesus."

WHAT IS THE QUESTION THAT PREACHERS AND CHURCH LEADERS NEED TO ADDRESS IN THIS MATTER OF WORSHIP AND PREACHING?

Are we given a clear mandate in Scripture as to how we are to Worship and Preach and Teach? What was Paul’s motive, what was Christ’s objective in his teaching, what was Peter and the apostles’ motivational mindset in doing the ministry that was given to them by the Lord Jesus Christ?

The only time Paul preached less than 29 minutes was when he was stoned, or thrown in jail by the crowd. Stephen’s sermon was cut short by his stoning.

Crafting a sermon? For what purpose do we speak?

“You’ve got to be a REALLY great communicator to keep attention for an hour. “ Todd said. Of course! Charles Tremendous Jones was a great communicator and could speak and keep my attention for an hour easily.

I am glad we are not living in Europe or Central America. Those leaders will speak for hours at a time. They have little concern with the attitude of those to whom they are speaking.

I have gone to Preachers’ Fellowships, and Paul Henderson would speak for 17 minutes, and get applause. Jack Hyles could speak for an hour and ten minutes and get applause. I am sure John Piper or John MacArthur could speak any length of time and get applause. Charles Stanley, did you know he speaks to thousands each week for over an hour? Charles Spurgeon, Jonathan Edwards, how long did they speak? Have you read a Spurgeon sermon?

And, of course, you could mention DeWayne Prossor’s two hour sermons. Kenny McComas could preach two hours on “prayer” and you would be in awe. Monroe Parker, Tom Malone, Lee Roberson, those fellows could preach. Roy A. Kemp could keep my attention as a boy and teenager preaching on Revelation for hours. But there were some who could speak thirty minutes, Raymond Barber, Wayne Martin, who could have you wishing they preached longer. I have said of a lot of preaching I have heard, they should have cut their message in half. (Of course I could mention their names as well, uh!) I have said “there are enough fillers in that sermon to fill a dump truck.” Take out the jokes, and farm illustrations and you have little biblical content.

The purpose of your preaching is. . . ? That is a good question to ask yourself.

Crag put it, “As communicators, we can become emotionally attached to information others simply don’t care about. Find those areas and cut them.” So then we are to craft our sermons around what the church, and the lost and Christians want to hear? We are to keep in mind the audience? Jesus did that, right? Paul did that, right? Peter did that, right? J.F. Norris did that, right? John MacArthur does that, right? John Piper does that, right? Oliver B. Greene did that, right? J. Vernon McGee did that, right?

“Information that people don’t want to hear, cut it out?” Let’s take a survey of our sermons, and let the people in our churches tell us what they don’t want us to say and they would rather we cut out of our sermons. Text message us while we preach and we will. E mail us this week and give us your ideas of what we should speak on next week.

Let’s ask Jeremiah and John the Baptist that question, “Boys, did you feel that your crowd that you were preaching to didn’t want to hear your message?” John, how did the Pharisees and Sadducees like your statement “O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come.” John, why would you want to stir up those religious groups like that?

The King said, “Tell me what I want to hear, or you will be killed.” That should have got the attention of the Prophet Daniel, and others. Today, the deacons will say, “Tell us what we want to hear and we will keep you, or you will be fired.” Ouch!

I will agree that many times we do need to cut out a lot of information like illustrations, jokes, comments that are rude, crude, and unacceptable, and self glorification of what we have done. Ouch!

(The photo: The series on Matthew: Twenty One volumes with twelve sermons in each volumes.) Manuscripts hand written. Several volumes not showned

PART THREE NEXT TIME

Friday, June 20, 2008

GOD HAS AN AMAZING WORLD(S)

GOD HAS AMAZING WORLDS OURSIDE OUR SOLAR SYSTEM

"We are still scratching the edges of that region of the solar system, and I expect many surprises await us," one scientist said. Above, Pluto and its moons are shown in an image taken by the Hubble Space Telescope. The planet is so far away that no clear pictures of it exist.

The first photo was taken outside our back yard. The sky is the home of God's world, and its growing. Science is learning just how big God's world is. I am not sure if God will keep the worlds in eternity, but if God does, I would like to visit those worlds. Just a thought.

PSALMS 24:1

"The earth is the LORD'S, and the fulness thereof; the world, and they that dwell therein."

DEUTERONOMY 10:14

"Behold, the heaven and the heaven of heavens is the LORD'S , the earth also, with all that therein is."

Photo from this site:

Thursday, June 19, 2008

SERMON - HOW LONG IS TOO LONG OR TOO SHORT

SERMONS AS A YOUTH PREACHER AT ROANOKE BAPTIST TEMPLE

"Dad, can I preach Sunday Night?" "Son, are you ready to preached, have you studied?" "How do I study for a sermon, Dad?" I was 15 then, and had little clue as to how to study. All I knew in those days, was watching Dad. Now Dad was sixty and had being preaching for forty years. He didn't need to study, I was thinking. He just gets up on Sunday and talks.

Dad had a wonderful library. He also owned a Bible Book Store. So I thought I will study some of the books in his library. I liked Charles Spurgeon sermons. Boy to read one sermon took a long time, Spurgeon must have preached two hours or more, to over 10,000 people each time he preached. Didn't they have anything else to do in 1850's and 60's?

I remember Al Myers and Don and I would travel to preach in youth revivals and youth rallies and in one church the preacher said to Al and Don, do you want to preach too. And Don would say, "I don't think there will be time after Charles gets finish preaching."

One time in Rocky Mount I can remember Don pointing out his watch, "Charles its time to stop."

Usually, us young preacher boys would preach about five minutes. I would preach thirty or more minutes. I could see the adults smiling as I preached. They were surprise to see that I could talk as long as I did.

Did I know how to preach? Nope. But I could read and study from Spurgeon and others.

HOW LONG SHOULD YOU PREACH! I guess until you are finished.

The photo above: Tonight I gathered up some of my sermon manuscripts.

I have some from Roanoke Baptist Temple back in 1963. Some from most of the churches I worked in. I have some from Madison Baptist Church where I was pastor for three years.

But most of the sermons are from First Baptist Church, in Altoona, Kansas.

The series from Romans and Matthew. (the top shelf of sermons) Matthew 17 volumes with 12 sermons in each volume. All all the message were hand written. Each sermons from Matthew was about fifty five minutes long. The book of Matthew was my first really verse by verse study. And I was learning how to study and learn how to interpret the text. Other series: Acts, I Corinthians, Ephesians, Philippians, Daniel, Revelation

And I guess I would study just the KJV. Kidding. I used a number of technical books. In 1983 I attended the Shepherd's Conference in California, and from that conference, learned what was meant by expository preaching. And I had to purchase those books I learned I needed from the conference.

While I would study from Harry Ironside for teaching lessons in Sunday School in Dad's church , I had to learn to study with the idea of preaching/teaching. I believe I have address this process in an earlier post.

All the sermons in the photo are manuscripts and were hand written. Goodness.

IS A 29 MINUTE SERMON SCRIPTURAL?

Why Speak 45 Minutes When You Could Speak 30 Minutes?

Over at Todd Rhoads site, he addressed the above issue. “WHY SPEAK 45 MINUTES WHEN YOU COULD SPEAK 30 MINUTES?” Todd quotes from Craig Groeschel about sermon/message length over at Swerve.

Todd makes this comment, “Over the years, most churches have changed everything about their services (in an effort to reach the culture) except their sermon length. My question is... where else in our culture do we ask people to sit and listen to a speaker for 45 minutes? I really can't think of one. And I do agree with Craig: many speakers look at how much time they have to fill rather than how much content they have to deliver. That, in and of itself, does not make for a culturally relevant presentation, does it”

Please check out their website and their articles and the comments, this will give you the background for this article.

So the question begs an answer.

I often hear “We want to be a New Testament Acts church.” That is a great objective. Let us ask Peter or Paul, or Stephen, or the other preachers, “Men, how long did you preach to the crowd before you?”

Do you think Paul or Peter would address the question: “We always view the audiences’ mindset and see if there is a need to tone down the message, we want to be culturally relevant?”

I believe we mistake the outline sermons we read in Acts to mean that Peter on the day of Pentecost only preached for 29 minutes. I think we believe that Christ in His Sermon on the Mount only preached in 29 minutes segments. I think some believe Christ crafted His sermons to be culturally sensitive.

Paul or Peter, “Did you use overhead screens, and a good power point presentation in the delivery of any of your sermons?” “Peter”, you might ask him, “How was the setting and lighting in the places you taught?” I don’t think many of their sermons were well received by the unchurched folks. I think they should have revised their methodology in preaching; maybe they could have stayed out of jail more.

So you might now say, “Maybe we need to have a 21st century kind of church, rather than an Acts kind of church.” Do we then change the message? Do we change the places we teach and preach? Do we craft a better presentation? Maybe we need to take a survey of what the people want.